Three PI Attorneys Share Their Stories, From Challenging Childhoods To Thriving Law Firms

Welcome to episode 56 of The Earley Show podcast, hosted by personal injury attorney Christopher Earley! For this conversation, both Neal Goldstein (Co-Founder of Goldstein & Bashner, P.C.) and Steven Eichenblatt (Founding Partner of Page and Eichenblatt) make their return to the show.

Check out the episode below. You can also enjoy it on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts and Amazon Music.

In this candid and deeply personal episode, Chris, Neal and Steven discuss childhood trauma, resilience, fatherhood and the unexpected power of writing a memoir. All three are personal injury attorneys who have not only built thriving practices but also published books about their most difficult life experiences. They discuss what drove them to write, how they got their books into the world, and why vulnerability might just be the most powerful marketing tool a lawyer has.

Guest Info:

Neal Goldstein — Co-Founder, Goldstein & Bashner, P.C.

Featured Book: Who's In The Waiting Room?: Create the Life You Want through the Power of Authentic Relationships

Podcast: That One Lawyer™ Podcast with Neal Goldstein

Steven Eichenblatt — Founding Partner, Page and Eichenblatt

Featured Book: Pretend They Are Dead: A Father's Search for the Truth

Website: https://www.stevenscotteichenblatt.com

Topics Covered:

-Writing as therapy — uncovering anger you didn't know you still had

-How childhood trauma and absent fathers shaped them as lawyers and as men

-The concept of "grit" (referencing Angela Duckworth's book Grit) and why PI lawyers often have it in spades

-Anger as a force multiplier — giving lawyers instant street cred and emotional connection with clients

-What to leave in (and out) of a memoir when it comes to kids, divorces, and parents

-Book launch strategies: publicists, Amazon reviews, social media, beta readers, book launch parties

-Tips for aspiring memoir writers: get a coach, just get it down, do it yourself, don't use AI

-How to weave your book into your law practice — giving it to clients, using it as a business card

People & Resources Mentioned:

-Angela Duckworth — Author of Grit: The Power of Passion and Perseverance

-John Fischer — Mastermind class organizer; encouraged Neal to write his own book rather than hire a ghostwriter

-Bill Umansky — Podcast host; Chris appeared on his show to discuss his memoir

-Greg Paige — Neal's law partner; facilitating the JCC author event

-Neal Goldstein's second book — "Who's in the Waiting Room? 68 Power Moves to Build a Law Firm Clients Can't Ignore for Personal Injury Lawyers That Refuse to Blend In"

About The Earley Show:

For nearly 20 years, Christopher Earley has successfully led a personal injury law firm in Boston. On the Earley Show, a new podcast launched in the summer of 2023, Christopher and other standout attorneys will be sharing their secrets to success, and discussing the law office management habits that have allowed their practice to thrive. If you’re looking to make better use of your time, increase daily productivity or even just spend less time answering emails, you’ll definitely want to tune in to The Earley Show.

Learn more about the Earley Law Group here!

Check out the previous episode of The Earley Show here!

The Earley Show is a part of The Answering Legal Podcast Network.

Interested in learning more about Answering Legal? Click here to learn more about 400 minute free trial!

This podcast is produced and edited by Joe Galotti. You can reach Joe via email at [email protected].

Episode Transcript:

CHRIS EARLEY (HOST)

Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the Earley Show sponsored by our friends over at Answering Legal. I'm your host Chris Earley and as you know on the Earley Show podcast we always bring you the very best and brightest in the legal industry. And here today is a real treat. We got two guys that have already been on the show before, but they're so good. We're bringing them back and we're having them both together on the call. We got Neal Goldstein. We got Steven Eichenblatt. Two of my friends. We've bonded over our unique stories and they're all very different, but they have a lot of shared elements. So, we are just — we don't have an agenda. We're going to riff. We're just gonna we're going to give to you, the audience, as much value as you possibly can. So, I'm just super grateful for your time, guys. Neal, if you don't mind, we start with you. For those who don't know Neal Goldstein, who the hell are you?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN (GUEST)

Sure. Who the — You're right. My my mother used to say that. Uh, no. Uh, uh, my name is Neal Goldstein. I'm an attorney. I've been practicing for about 35 years here in New York, uh, Long Island. I'm a personal injury lawyer. Uh, I have two children. I have two books. Same — these two books right here. I'm sure we'll talk about it. And, uh, I have a podcast, uh, and I still practice law. So, yeah, we'll we're ready to talk.

CHRIS EARLEY

Very good. Thank you, Neal. Steve, introduce yourself, please, sir.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT (GUEST)

Sure. Yeah, I'm Steve Eichenblatt and I've also been practicing — I think 38 years now. So, I beat I beat Neal and Chris — Chris is just a little baby. But, um, I'm here in Orlando, Florida. I just do personal injury. I started out as an insurance defense lawyer. Uh, in my spare time, I I try to manage my five kids and uh two ex-wives and one current wife who I love. So, it's good. It's a good thing. And uh I also recently published a book and I'm excited to talk with you guys. It's always fun.

CHRIS EARLEY

I love it.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Hey, Steven, do you — are you sure you want to say that you manage your ex-wives?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Yeah. Well, I thought that was politically correct.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Really?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

I didn't — Yeah. Yeah. No, they're good. It's all good.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

All right. Cool.

CHRIS EARLEY

I love it. So, I'm telling you, we have, you know, the three of us have been through a few rodeos. All different rodeos but we have gone through challenges and look at us — you know, we run thriving PI practices. And so I just want to talk about, you know, first — I met Neal, Neal wrote his book, his memoir, and I said this guy Neal Goldstein on Long Island, and look how far we've come — now we're friends. You inspired me to write my book, and then I was on Billy Umansky's podcast talking about my book when it came out, and then Steve heard me and he reached out to me. And now Steve and I are friends, and I introduced you guys I believe.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Correct.

CHRIS EARLEY

Hey, you guys got to meet each other. It's just funny how things work. But I just want to talk about, you know, we're kind of in a different category because we've written memoirs about our our struggles, our challenges, our successes. What inspired you guys to to write your book? Why did you why did you even do all that hard work in the first place?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Yeah, I I I think initially the idea was — I I don't know. I, you know, my mom left me a bunch of photographs and some furniture. Not much money at all, believe me. And uh and a lot of memories. A lot of memories. And and some that weren't that good. And I wanted to leave — initially my thought was I'm going to leave something to my kids that was a bit more than that. I wanted to leave them something that they could understand and put the pieces together — why I might have been laughing in this picture and why I might have been angry here. And so, you know, give them some background which they may not otherwise have, and maybe give them the tools that I used in order to navigate a very sclerotic family world. And so that kind of morphed after I spoke to a number of people and said, "Well, why don't you uh write the book with the idea of letting other people who might have similar situations also in on your on how you navigated this difficult journey." And so that's what I did.

CHRIS EARLEY

I love that. Thank you, Neal. Steve, why did you write your book?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Yeah. No, you know, sort of like Neal, I — my father, biological father had passed away and he left uh not just photographs, but it turned out he — he was a writer. And I I do talk about this in my book, but he is a writer and he wrote almost every day of his life between 1960 and 1990. He was a veterinarian, but was a writer, and and I didn't I didn't know him while he was alive because he left me when I was was very young. And um so I decided — I I'd gone through a divorce — that I wanted to try to put things on paper. It started out more of a journaling um more of a journaling session. And then I actually started to believe, you know, I I actually can write this story and I'm a pretty good writer. And because for the first time in a long time, I was writing outside the legal boundaries. I was just putting whatever it is I wanted on paper. And that became really therapeutic for me. Um, just going through parts of my life that I hadn't really closely examined and and plucking out where some of the anger was still existing. And because the one thing — certainly one of the things that we all have in common — we've all overcome some significant childhood trauma and and persevered. And so I wanted to share that story with with people because there's so many that we know that go through trauma who decide that they're going to be a victim and not do anything with their lives. And uh here are three guys who used that, you know, to — Yeah. To motivate themselves.

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah, for sure. I love that. Personally, I wrote mine because I I felt the itch to write it, you know. I just I just had to do it. So once you commit to it, you're you're kind of off to the races. The the the horse is out of the barn. It's getting done. So, like I was saying, I wrote my memoir because — like Neal, you know, like Steven — just wanted to have a testament for my kids, have, you know, a record of why dad is the way he is, the good parts about dad, the flawed parts about about dad. But, but the common element, you know, the three of us have is, you know, growing up around an element of dysfunction. You know, Neal, you you know, you're a high school dropout. You know, now you're an accomplished personal injury attorney, author. It's it's it's rare air that you've you've reached notwithstanding, you know, all your challenges. Steven, you know, you you had un — unimaginable cruelty in many ways, right? Um, at at the hands of of of the person you write about quite a bit in the book. So, I I just think we're really kind of — nothing really unique about us. We just sort of like got through, right? And like just sort of like put our heads down and and and got through these difficult times. Why do you think you guys were able to succeed despite heavy childhood stuff?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

I think for me, you know, I think — and that goes to the core of the book — is that I was lucky enough to meet other people who embraced me. I was lucky enough to have other people who believed in me, who thought there could be a future for me when I didn't even know what the day was going to be like. And so, you know, I was an angry kid. Sure you guys know about that. And I was lost. I wasn't a bad kid — like you guys, you know, we weren't bad kids.

CHRIS EARLEY

Right.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

But we we we had no real person, male figure in our life that we could look up to. And that's common amongst, I think, the three of us. Uh but we had, you know, other people that that reached out to us, whether it was a a girlfriend or the other parent or a sibling that helped us in some way, maybe it was an employer, whatever. And so, you know, I think that if you're open to embracing other people — which I wasn't initially — but then I took a chance in one particular uh situation, and it worked out really well for me, and I just kept on doing that.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Part of it for me was uh I I grew up with an, you know, adopted stepfather who was violent and mean in every way and always told me I'd never amount to anything. And so for a long time I just wanted to prove him wrong. Once I got past the defiance um and out of high school I realized, you know, he's calling me a loser. So part of my motivation, as as weird as that sounds, is this horrible voice in my head saying, "You'll never amount to anything." So — so that was certainly part of part of my motivation. And then I didn't really have a mentor. Um, I just — there wasn't anybody in my life that I could really turn to um because I I wound up moving in a lot of different places. But when I lived in Israel, I recognized that the only person that was going to help me was was me.

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah. Yeah.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Yeah. And you know, and it's funny if I could just uh you know, jump in. We all have male figure uh important male figures that were absent early in our lives, but I think Steven was the only one that was actually able to see his father, his natural father, uh at some point. I I don't think it worked out, uh but but uh he was able to have some conversation — at whatever however menial it might have been. And and yet Chris, in your book it took a really different turn. And I don't want to give away things, but uh you you had these dreams almost with your father — you and your father having these conversations — which I thought was a really cool way to uh to have you know the reader understand your journey. I thought it was really really cool. I on the other hand also uh I think I saw my father once uh after he left. I saw him a couple of times. Then I saw him the next time maybe 40 years later. And I don't know, it was just — it's it's just very interesting. All three male figures absent. Uh and and you know, we all had some — well, not all — but the two of us had some real contact later on in life, which was both in both cases uh meaningless in in in many ways. Uh to some extent. Steven has has some — it it wasn't completely meaningless. Uh and and for Chris uh you know it was it was not — I don't think you had that ability, right?

CHRIS EARLEY

No, no. Yeah.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Don't you don't you guys think that the the anger that you had from going through such a rough rough childhood and rough circumstances makes you a better personal injury lawyer? Like I I think because you've gone through so much and and now you're dealing with people who are going through uh certain things.

CHRIS EARLEY

I think it gives you cred — like instant street cred — like here's my book, you know, I'm an open book, read my story and how challenged it's been, and and I've had to get through so I can relate to you, you know, as being involved in an accident. You know I don't know what it's like to be in the accident with you, but yeah I I I think that it's like an equalizer. I was talking about like getting on client's level. Like what better way to get on clients' level? Hey, like I understand struggle. I'm not some, you know, hoity-toity lawyer up in an ivory tower. I speak the language of resilience.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

So, and and and you know, I think I might have said to both of you that it's almost like a force multiplier uh that that you have these assets uh which we could now call them. You have these assets. We wouldn't call that back then — we would just want a new father or new parents, whatever the case is. But you have assets now that the next person — while they might be a good lawyer and they might have you know feelings for other people — there's no way that they can feel what we feel unless you've been through that. And so, yes, it does give you that extra oomph uh when you're dealing with people. By the way, I'm still angry. Uh, I mean, I — there's parts of me that, you know, there's there are days that I still uh I still am resentful after 25 years of therapy.

CHRIS EARLEY

I was going to ask you guys about that. Thank you, Neal. Steven, do you feel like you're still angry? How do you feel in general?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Um, you know, I definitely still have — I definitely still have anger in me. There's no — so, there's no question about that.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Is that why the police are coming?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Yeah, exactly. Something must happen. We're right near the hospital, you know. We're personal injury lawyers, so we got to be close. Got to be on it, you know. But oh, I definitely still — I definitely still have anger. And my wife says you get wild eyes or whatever. Um. But one of the things — by you know, and for those who are might be listening that want to are considering writing a memoir — I know like for me, I realized that there were things in my life that I was much angrier about than I thought. Like for example, we moved from New Jersey to Florida my senior year of high school. And man, as I was writing this book, you know, 40 years later, I'm like, that really sucked, man. I I am really angry about that. And there's no way — no one for me to talk to about it, but um so there's certainly things that still, you know, are still inside and they and they don't leave. Maybe they tell a little bit, you know, but we can all relate to that residual anger.

CHRIS EARLEY

I've talked openly. I I meditate a lot. I journal. Start doing a little bit of yoga. Always trying to find a little softener to that. But I almost feel like we have an unfair advantage. You talk about the force multiplier, which is awesome. It's almost like an unfair advantage. You you could look at guys like us. Oh, like poor them. It's like no — like those are — it was all meant to be. Unfortunately, that was our plot in life to struggle early. Yes. But then, you know, we're able to — you know, I just I know we we work really hard because we have a certain DNA of of getting over. I don't know if a lot of lawyers have that, to be honest with you. So, I I embrace that competitive advantage. It's almost unfair because —

Neal GOLDSTEIN

But you know what I think — I think you said to me, Chris, uh on our podcast uh I think it was Grit by Angela Duckworth.

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

And I didn't get a chance to read the entire book, but I read some of it. And apparently the thesis is — correct me if I'm wrong — that a disproportionate amount of successful people had one thing in common. That was grit. Now, that could be defined differently, right? But they all felt something inside of them that said, "I have to show them or I have to do this because this happened to me." Some kind of grit that you're just not — you're not born with grit. Uh it's — it — you might be in some cases, but I don't think you are. I think it evolves based on early experiences.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Yeah. I think I think too like when you talk about when you talk about grit, what's what's interesting is now I don't know if any of you guys are like scholarly law reviewed with honors kind of guys. Um but I — and I certainly wasn't. I mean we're we're fighters from day one, you know, really. And and that that inside certainly, you know, that certainly creates the grit that that that helps. And I have learned since then that I've talked to so many lawyers who have contacted me and had similar stories. And most of them are personal injury lawyers or criminal lawyers — that's interesting, you know — they're not corporate guys sitting down there. They're um — it's — I think our our practice kind of goes along with with how we grew up.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Absolutely. Yeah.

CHRIS EARLEY

I love that. You know, I wonder — I hope that we inspire — because there's a lot of people on this call that can resonate, relate to what we're talking about. We're not that unusual, right? We just talk about it and we've published about it. But there's a lot of guys and gals who can relate. I mean, everyone has struggle, you know, coming up. You know, I'd like to ask you guys — like, what do you think your dads would think about your success right now? I think my dad would be like, "Holy shit." Like, "Are you f**king me? Like, I can't believe what you did." I'm I'm a humble dude. I'm not bragging. I think he'd be like, "Wow." Like, good for you. What do you guys think your dads would think about what you guys did with your life?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Oh boy, that that that's that's a tough one.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

That's a great question. It is.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Uh well, I could tell you when I I saw my father when my son was three. My son is now 30. I saw him one time in those 40 years or whatever. Uh he — it was just — excuse my language — but he often thought that it was like there was nothing. I mean, it was like it was just weird. And like he said to his then third wife, he said, "Look at my son. He's a lawyer." And I'm thinking, "Yeah, but you had no part in that. There was nothing that you did." What do I think? I think honestly I think he'd probably want to take credit for it.

CHRIS EARLEY

Oh, wow. Okay.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

I don't — would he be happy? Yeah. Because he felt as though he created that. And so that's the type of mentality that he had. I don't think he would sit there and say, "Oh, I did such a — I did so many bad things and I abandoned you. I absconded from the house." I don't think he would say any of that, but you know, I mean, that's all guessing, right?

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Yeah. That — no, that's such a great question, Chris. And I really um I hadn't thought thought that before because, you know, I I have such a bad opinion of my, you know, kind of two fathers — one adopted, one biological. But um I don't think it would mean anything to my adopted father cuz you know he was the one that was always putting me down and I don't think he would ever give anybody credit for anything. So um and my biological father — I I think inside he would be proud but I don't think he would ever say it, because he never — because he could have said it and he never did. So, um, so that's — I that's kind of how — what do what do you think?

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah, like I said, I think my dad would — I I hope he'd be proud. But like you know, Neal said, he didn't have any anything to do with this. I'm his biological son, but like he didn't put me through school. He he didn't provide. So, totally, you know, not only not — almost like a like a liability, I'm sorry to say it, but no no assisting, no asset into my life. It was more like suppressing, you know, his his absence was was a suppressor.

AD BREAK

CHRIS EARLEY

I want to share two — listening to you guys talk, I'm thinking I want to share two things, you know, very brutally honestly. Neal's book, as I said, impacted me so much I was like, god damn, I got to write my own book. Okay, so when my book came out and I read Steven's book, I was outside on my hammock. Um, truth be told, I listened — I listened to your book because Steven's book is like fat, you know.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. You know, I wasn't expecting that.

CHRIS EARLEY

No. And I I was crying on my hammock listening to it. I was trying to hide the tears. My wife was in the house right behind me. You know, the the stories of Richard — it's it's brutal, you know, and I just I I can't, you know, I I can't imagine what that was like. Uh, unreal. I use the word cruelty, man. Like, it's all I can think of.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

But, you know, when I read Steve's book, I — yes, I was angry at Richard. There's no question. I'm not — there's no defense of whatever sickness, mental illness that he that he portrayed. But I was also angry at his mother. I'm sorry, Steven.

CHRIS EARLEY

Same.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Of course.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

And I'm sure I'm sure you had feelings about that.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Oh, yeah. Oh, no. That's — and that's come up. That's come up quite, you know, quite a bit. Um, last last week I had the, uh, fortune of being actually invited to speak um, up at Chapel Hill to a group of family lawyers. This is a special group that gets together.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Very nice.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

It was really great. It was incredible. And um, they had all read my book. So, one of the — the person who runs the section had — he had he had got my book somewhere and he liked it so much he decided to invite me to speak about it. And you know this a couple months back. And it was it was you know it's it's it's you know there's a little bit of like impostor syndrome. We walk in, everybody's, "Man, that book is great," and da da da. But and it's hard to — I'm not good at taking compliments. But but several of them said that they had been like really emotional when they were reading it, tearful, and I said to one of uh one of the women like, you know, that that probably means something resonates inside with what I wrote. Something resonates with you and you probably need to get it out.

CHRIS EARLEY

So that was a group of lawyers, you said, right?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Group of lawyers, right? Right.

CHRIS EARLEY

So like Richard who told you you would amount to sh*t, right? And then and then here you are talking about your book, your memoir, and trying to accomplish that in that room — like that's crazy, man. That's that's the point of the book to share, right?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

And and that's the that's the other asset that I think we — that the three of us have — because because people could — there there are lots of people that have lots of stories, some worse than ours. Yes. And and yet they don't have the ability for one reason or another to be able to share that. Either they're they're they're suppressing it or they're uh you know they're just embarrassed. Uh they don't really know how to how to say it. But the fact that we can not only speak about it but write a book which anybody in the world can see. And and and you know they're not very nice things in there uh about you know one of our parents, right? And uh to be able to do that — and that was a struggle for me uh when I was writing — how much am I going to reveal here? Yeah. And I — even though I I did keep a few things that had to do with my kids out — but um yeah, I I felt like if I was going to be true to the book, I had to put more in than out.

CHRIS EARLEY

Steve, how'd you feel about that exercise, that challenge?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think I think, you know, as far as what what to put in and what not to — I wanted to make sure that my book, if my kids read it, that they weren't affected. So, I didn't write anything about, you know, my divorces because we've all led multiple lives, and I went through a couple divorces. And um and I I get along fine with my ex-wives, as I as I mentioned — it wasn't always like that, but I didn't want to go into that because that that would just hurt them. Um, and I wanted to be I wanted to be respectful. But on the on the other side, uh when you mentioned my mother — when I went to the family law group, and and going to a group where they've all read the book, which was really was really interesting. Because you can always tell when somebody's read or not read the book. They may say they are, but you can tell. But but you know there were many questions about what my mother was doing, you know, and how I felt about her. And um, you know, and and she's my mother so I I I'm trying to be a good Jewish son so and and be there for her. But I still — you know, parts of me hates her, really. Part of me does.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Wow. Wow.

CHRIS EARLEY

You know and and I can understand — I I I don't know what that's like but I can see why you — I mean you have a right to feel that way. How is this — you know the irony is that you know we all became fathers, right? You know we we didn't have a healthy, fun, high-functioning family environment, and in many ways we still, you know, became fathers, right? You know, really successful fathers at that — which isn't easy to do because I didn't see the blueprint, right? Like like us both of you — there there was no playbook that was given, like this is how you be a healthy dad. I had to witness that, to witness healthy marriage, right? So I've had to do this sort of on the fly, right? And and figure stuff out. But it's really like — that's — I don't know what you guys think personally, but I think I'm on this earth — I know it — to be a dad. That's why I'm here. That's like my whole living, my purpose. What — how did your struggles early on? How did it impact the father you would become?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Yeah. I mean, you know, I always say that uh you know, bringing up my kids was uh — and I get very emotional, so if I get emotional, I apologize. That's just that's that's part of who I am. Uh, you know, bringing up my my kids was uh some of the best moments in my life. And uh I really tried and I think I was there for most of the important things in their lives. And at this point one is 30 and the other one is 23. You know I probably have spent most of my time with them already. Most of my time has already been spent with them. And uh I don't — if I was on my last day I wouldn't have any regrets about the time that I spent with them. I in fact probably unlike many other people that I know uh lawyers and non-lawyers who spend so much time — and I'm not making a judgment, just saying what I've done — and and you know, put so much effort into their work, and maybe they're successful, maybe they're not, but took away from their time with their kids. I did the opposite. Uh I spent as much time as possible with my kids, maybe to the sacrifice of my practice at some points, but no regrets. No regrets. And uh uh yeah, am I perfect? No. But, uh, I think my kids would look at me and say — you know, I'd like to think that they would say I was a great dad. But it depends. It depends what day it is.

CHRIS EARLEY

That's amazing. That's amazing.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Yeah. I mean, for for me um I think — and not not having a great role model for a dad — I think in some ways I was too easy. Like, you know, because I wanted to do everything with the kids and for the kids because I didn't have the opportunity to have my own experience with my own father. So you know I coached little league, I coached soccer. I I spent so much time with my kids. Uh, I sort of forgot about my wife and that was part of my marital issue because I was — my my oldest son — he had some special needs growing up. He was sort of a maniac and he took a lot — caused a lot of stress. But I spent a ton of time with with him. And you know I have five kids um. But I really — like like you said, Chris and Neal — those are that's the most important thing. And one of the things — and so I still try to be in contact with my kids every day. I I have in my in my office um — there's a — you guys can appreciate this — I went to a Bruce Springsteen concert with three of my sons. And long story very short, they they do a lottery because we were on the floor. And my my crazy son was the first one picked to go into the arena. And even though he had showed up late anyway, we go in and there's there's these three boys, my three sons, right against the stage. Right against the stage. And and I was just — and one of my sons is a musician — but I was like, I was getting tearful, because they were just in awe. Right there, Springsteen paying attention — he's got the three little kids in the front row. And so watching my kids get that kind of joy — that to me means — that meant everything.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

That's great.

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah. Just one moment in time, but massive, right? Massive big moment. That's awesome.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

You know, by the way, it's funny — when you're talking and Steven is talking, uh you could see, you know, you could see everybody's head shaking, you know, like, yeah, I — obviously we we all have uh similar uh — even though the stories are different and they are — uh there's just a common thread all the way through.

CHRIS EARLEY

A strong one. There's no question. There's no question about that. So, when you guys released your book, how did it — um, how did you — well, let me backtrack. How did you how did you get it out to the masses? Right. You could write a book, that's wonderful, but if no one reads it, what's the point? How did you guys push it out so it got out there to the world?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Steve, you want to go first?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, man. That's that's like the hardest. Writing the book was hard, but but getting people to buy it's a whole another story. And listen, I I like sharing my story so it'll help other people, and and I didn't have this expectation I'm going to have some massive bestseller. But but you still — you know, we all — we're lawyers, man, and we're we're pushers and we we're competitive. And um so it was — I I did a lot of work before the book release. Uh, I made — I I read a lot about book launches. I actually have a publisher who had a publicist, so I was able to use a publicist for a few months that got me on some podcasts. Um, and I have the advantage — my one of my sons does social media, so he did some videos for me. And I had lined up a lot of people in advance to do Amazon reviews because I think that's a huge part — is Amazon reviews. Um, before so that by the time — by the time it launched, you know, in the first week, I had a really good number of reviews and the book was starting to to get out, you know, a little bit. And one of the other things I did too, which um you know, for people that are out there that might want to write a book — is I, you know, you've got to show it to other people before you publish it to see, okay, does this suck or is this incredible? Like, you know, you got to get some. And my my daughter's a writer in California. And so I — during the writer strike, ironically — uh I asked her if she could line up like five friends and I would pay them to read the book and give me an independent review. Um, because they didn't know me. And um and so that was really helpful because I got some great feedback. I mean honest great feedback. And that I changed, you know. And so so I put a lot of time into into the launch and the marketing and the cover — like both you guys have great book covers, very cool — and and I put a lot of time into our cover. But it's a it's a journey, man.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Yeah, it's it's it's uh I don't know. I think the first — the first thing I I I knew from, you know, off the top of my head, I says, "Well, you know, I'm self-publishing this." And uh I was very happy to have the publisher that I did, even though it was a self-publishing company. Uh they they were fairly well-known. And I I asked uh a number of people uh in our legal circle if they would read the uh book uh and then give me a review. And they did and and many of them gave me really nice reviews. And so they put that out on social and that was that was very helpful and that was very nice. We did a a a book launch party at a really nice hotel um uh not far from where I live and invited a bunch of people and uh the word got out from there. And yeah, the first — I'd say the first two months uh was was really — it went from the people that I knew and were I knew were going to get the book, to other people who I didn't know and got the book. In fact, in fact, uh I'll just pat myself on the back here — I got uh because I like doing that. Uh, I I got I got an email — I got an email from a young lady who I met during John Fischer's mastermind uh class in uh in Chicago, because I went out for a drink. I think it was afterwards or something, and I was sitting at the bar by myself and I just started talking to her. She was, you know, she tended bar. We were just chatting and I says, "Well, I'm going to leave you, you know, my book. Uh, I don't have it with me, but I'll leave it for you tomorrow." And, uh, and I did. I dropped the book by. She wasn't in. Three years later, she sends me an email. She says, "I just want you to know how you changed my life. That I um that I went back to school. I went um I became a paralegal. And now I'm thinking about law school." And having read your book um uh it was so uh significant in in motivating me to move forward. And if I could just take one more minute — the the the real moment — and this has a lot to do with, you know, putting my book out there. Uh, I got a call within a week after the book was out from somebody that I knew, but it was more my wife's friend and had nothing to do with the law. She had, you know, I wasn't I didn't really know her well. And she said, "Neal, I just want you to know that I read your book." And her uh significant other and her were going out for dinner and they were going to talk about the relationships that they have and how they could build even more relationships based on my book. And when I heard that, I felt really, really satisfied. I said, "Now I understand why I wrote it." And you know, you try to put it out there as much as as you can. Every time I meet a new client or I I give them a book, I let them take a look at it. Uh and uh they're they're always pretty impressed. Now, obviously, their lawyer wrote a book and now they have it and that's great. Uh many of the people read it and I get back get feedback from them. I try to keep it top of mind as much as I can. Uh it's still out there. So, that's pretty much how I distributed the books.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

How long, Neal? How long has your book been out? The first one.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Since 2022.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Got it.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

2022.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

And you actually have two.

CHRIS EARLEY

You wrote a second book, right?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

I wrote a second book. Yeah. That wasn't a memoir. It was just some practical advice to personal injury lawyers.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

I bought it. Excellent. I liked it.

CHRIS EARLEY

I believe you said that second book took off or did better.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Uh well the re — the it — the second book took off because uh I I published it through Amazon and uh so it was a lot less expensive to to publish uh and it was practical advice. So that might attract more people than — hey here's my memoir and there's some stuff in here that you might want to look at and find out about yourself. These are real practical tips. So, I guess yeah, it it — I I definitely did much better in the first 6 months of that than than my first book in terms of actual numbers, however you want to define that.

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah. Yeah, for sure. For sure.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

What about you?

CHRIS EARLEY

I didn't hire, you know — you guys did it a little more professional way. I I hired a coach and that was about it. And then she enlisted a line editor, copy editor, all the editors, you know. But I would encourage — I I want us to share some some some tips to the aspiring author, the lawyer, the artist, whoever's listening, right? And wants to write their book. My advice would be get a coach. And also — who are you writing the book for? Because like Steven, you mentioned you're a writer. I'm not a writer. Like I can't write for sh*t. Yeah. So I had to learn to write creatively. My my coach kept saying you have to learn to write to show rather than write to tell. And so and so Neal — what you just said about getting those messages about your book — isn't it funny how some people just — it's crickets. You know, they read the book, they don't even mention it. Where some people are like, holy sh*t, I was crying — you have me — it's like it hits a minority super hard but most of like oh yeah they don't even mention it. But that's why you wrote it for — for that that like you know that that impact on that select few. But that's my advice. Get a coach. Know who you're writing for. Don't cheap out. Like I wrote my book on my own. My coach said — she's like, "Love it, Chris. This is sh*t. We're going to rewrite this thing." Like, "Oh my god, I had a book. I had to rewrite it." You know, I could take some parts, but seriously, starting from scratch. She was like, "Because we're going to write an actual book." What — that's my my two cents for the aspiring author who's never been down this path. What would you guys say to that guy or gal wanting to write their memoir who has that itch like we had?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

I would I I tell you I would I would say, you know, for whoever is thinking about doing it — is just get it down. Just sit down and and just start typing, writing, whatever it is. Don't worry about grammar. Don't worry about sentence structure, any of that stuff the first time through. Just let your brain wander to the to the places it takes you, because it is incredible how when you start writing and you get into it — what you know — there's stuff. And it makes me laugh, Chris, because I've said it's like — you'll write like I would write every morning and then maybe I'd come back the next day and I and I'd look and I'd say, god man, that is really terrible. I can't believe I wrote that. Embarrassing. Or you know or uh or or other things like I'd read it and go, man, did I write that? I said, man, that that's — that's good. So, you know, you just get it down on paper, you know, you just gotta — you just don't stop um. Don't stop and worry about you know periods and commas at the beginning.

CHRIS EARLEY

Love it, man.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

You you must have you must have been sitting right next to me because I was saying the same stuff. Uh, no, it's true. And and what you know the thing that I would say uh to anybody — and I — Chris, you and I talked about this when we first talked because I had — I initially hired somebody who was going to write it for me as I spoke about it. Bad move. I wasted three days in Michigan with that and I was very upset at myself. And then I called John Fischer and he said — and I'm giving him the credit here — he says, "Neal, you have to write it yourself."

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

And I said, "Oh sh*t." Because I mean — and and so so I honestly — during it was just before COVID, then into COVID — I would be sitting at the public library and I and I would I would just shut down for 4 hours when I could do it. And uh it was cathartic. But do it yourself. Do it yourself because it won't sound the same. No matter how professional or how good somebody is, it won't be the same.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Don't use AI.

CHRIS EARLEY

You know, that's — don't use — yeah, that's true. That's true. That's true.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

You know, AI is crazy. It's a crazy tool.

CHRIS EARLEY

Yeah, for sure. For sure. You can write like five books in one afternoon probably, you know. Steven, any tips you can give to the aspiring writer who wants to do it?

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Yeah. I mean, like I said, just, you know, if you're really interested in doing it — like I'm a I'm a runner, you know, done a bunch of marathons, half marathons, all that. And so, I kind of approached it the same way I did with my running — is I I set my schedule and I would sit for, you know, two hours — get up really early because that's I'm really good in the morning — and I would for like two hours every day. I would try to I would try to write a chapter a week. So, um, and then the other the other thing I did — like a writing workshop — and what was great about that was I met other people. Like it'd be like being in a writing workshop with you guys that I could — we could talk about writing. Cuz because I got to say like at the beginning I was embarrassed to tell anybody. I was, you know, I just I didn't tell anybody I was writing this like vulnerable memoir. Here it is. Um, because I was — I was like, you know, you you've got — at some point you have to expose yourself and you're putting yourself out there and I'm not really great with criticism. So, you know, it's like uh and I don't like being wrong because I'm a lawyer. So, uh but anyway, so so yeah, don't be afraid to to to go to workshops, to share your work, you know, set a schedule and stick to it.

CHRIS EARLEY

Just do the work. You got to want to do the work. It's hard as hell. It's also one of my biggest accomplishments — never — most folks don't get finished. And and we finish that — cross that that line, you know, of getting it done. And and we're busy busy lawyers, you know, we got a lot going on. We got people, you know, all over us wanting stuff. And you had intentionally set set that time apart. I'm curious as we wrap up — I want to hear how you guys weave it into your practice. Personally, I think I've mentioned to you guys — I send it to every single new client. They get it in a box with amongst other things. But I want them to know who I am. Frankly, I want them to know like who they just hired. I'm not gonna front and be, you know, stiff. I'm going to be who I am. You know, what do you guys do with with your clients and, you know, sharing it with them?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Well, I could tell you that when I meet a client, uh, the first thing I say to them — uh, I don't even talk about the accident. The first thing I say to them is, "Tell me something about yourself." And they do and then they're kind of thrown for a minute, but but they do. And inevitably something in the next that that 15 or 20 minute stretch — sometimes it's longer — um, there's something we have in common. And then that leads me to say, well, I'd like you to know something about the the person you're about to hire. And so I give them the short version of course of the story, or part of the story that I think they most would would like to hear just from listening to their story. And so, uh, and often I have the books in my trunk and I I give them a copy of the book and they love it. And it's 10 times better than a business card. And, uh, and and it just it just gives you some credibility in a world where there's so much effing noise. You now have some standing with them.

CHRIS EARLEY

You're you're legit. It's not right — it's not a book — it's not just a book. It could be a book on anything. It's a it's a book about...

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

You!

CHRIS EARLEY

How screwed up. With all respect, because we all are. However, we use that for good.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Correct.

CHRIS EARLEY

You shared it with the world. I love that. I love it.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Um, so I'm going to I'm going to go off the topic for one second. I wanted to show you in my my office. I don't know if you could see this, but — can you see that the Bruce Springsteen photo? Can you guys see that?

CHRIS EARLEY

A little bit.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

A little bit. Yeah.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Let's see. Let's see how we get that. Anyway, that's my that's my Bruce Springsteen — the kids at the Bruce Springsteen concert that I was just telling you. It sits in my office.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Very cool. Very cool.

CHRIS EARLEY

That's awesome, man.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

April 24th, 2008. That's how long ago that was. And then the other thing I'm doing is um — and again I don't know how to turn my phone around but I don't know if you guys can read any of this — but I'm doing a an author meet and greet at the Jewish Community Center with another writer named Jay Fraadus. Oh I think you told me about this. Yeah. And I'm nervous about it because, you know, this is this is going to be — it's it's you know, you're putting yourself out of the out of the comfort zone. You're putting yourself out of your comfort zone. And it's easy for me to get up and talk about a case or to talk about Neal or Chris, but to talk about myself in front of a — you know, I don't know how many people we're going to get, but probably a few hundred. And um, I think and that's that's a you know — and that when you talk about incorporating in the firm — I have not given my book to many clients yet. Um, I probably will. It just it just uh — and I think I talked to Chris about this like I know because I knew he did it. I have since you and I spoke about it have have been much more liberal about giving books to people that, you know, are helping me, or I thought like you know I have some in my car that you know I might — that might enjoy it. And um so uh but I I am I do plan on doing a little bit more marketing with it. So like this event, this author meet and greet for example — um, my law partner Greg Paige is going to be the facilitator. So, and that's great for us because it's it's it's him and it's me. And then we have a a guy who's a a mediator who wrote a bestseller, a legitimate bestseller, and has another book coming out. And I found out that he had just released a new book. So, um, we uh, you know, I got him to to to do this with me and he's a chatterbox. So, it should be good.

CHRIS EARLEY

That's awesome.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

That's great. That's that's great.

CHRIS EARLEY

You know what was cool for me? I got my book into a couple libraries around here and when the book came out — when it first got into this one library, my daughter — I was like, "Let's go look for dad's book." And she found it. I recorded her reaction.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

I saw that, man. That's awesome.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

That's great.

CHRIS EARLEY

That's the whole deal. Like that's like winning dad life for me. Like I'm good. Like no matter what happens, like you know, just like showing up and like showing that you can do hard things.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Yeah. Absolutely.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

That was cool. Your girl — your kids are nice and young. They're at that like impressionable age. And my kids um, you know, trying to get them interested in my story is a little hard.

CHRIS EARLEY

Of course different stages, but I'm right behind you, man. Right behind you.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Yeah, that's great. That's great.

CHRIS EARLEY

I love that. Well, guys, I appreciate — how can people get in touch with you guys? You know, we got such you know, powerhouse stories on this call. Let's keep the conversation going. How can people um get in touch with you guys?

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Well, well for me I I mean there's a million ways so I'll just tell you to go to Google and just type Neal Goldstein lawyer and I think you'll be fine. You you'll find me somewhere. Just look at the face. Same face. You'll find it

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

I mean, for me it's um uh stevenscotteichenblatt.com. E-i-c-h-e-n-b-l-a-t-t. There's not a lot of Steven Scott Eichenblatts out there. out there. Probably a few more Goldsteins.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

A few more. Few more.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Um, or Amazon. My book is called Pretend They Were Dead. Uh and you can take you can take a look at that. So, I'm I'm I'm excited because I'm over 200 reviews now.

CHRIS EARLEY

Wow!

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

That's great.

CHRIS EARLEY

That's like — that's like 2,000 reviews. That's a lot.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

It's a lot, man. I wish it was 2,000 sales. Well, I'm not exactly sure how many sales we had, but you know, at least 200.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

That's great.

CHRIS EARLEY

Your book came out in the summer, right, of last year, of '25.

STEVEN EICHENBLATT

Father's Day, June.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

That's great. That's great. Wow. Good for you. Congratulations.

CHRIS EARLEY

Guys. I appreciate your time.

NEAL GOLDSTEIN

Thanks, Chris. Thanks, Chris.

CHRIS EARLEY

Thanks for being, you know, friends and and and people that, you know, speak my language. I get that there's a lot of people on this call. They get this. They speak our language of of resilience and getting over. So, reach out to any of us. We're literally, as I said, open books here. We're here to help you because we've we've had a few uh rodeos. We're happy to share of our knowledge. Gentlemen, thank you so much. Nothing but love for you guys.

Neal GOLDSTEIN

Thanks. Thank you very much.

CHRIS EARLEY

All right, guys. That's it for this episode of The Earley Show. Be sure to check out more episodes of our show on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and the Answering Legal YouTube channel.